Becoming a Stronger Parent During Divorce with Heather Quick
Navigating Divorce While Parenting: How to Put Your Kids First
Seth and Pete sit down with Heather Brooke Quick, the founder and CEO of Florida Women's Law Group, to discuss how to become a better, stronger parent during and after divorce. Heather shares her expertise on helping clients navigate co-parenting challenges and putting their children's needs first.
Seth, Pete, and Heather dive into the importance of focusing on the big picture and remembering that co-parenting is a lifelong commitment. They discuss strategies for keeping animosity in check, even when dealing with contentious issues like finances. Heather emphasizes the value of taking the high road and modeling positive behavior for your children.
Questions we answer in this episode:
How can I shield my kids from the negative aspects of divorce?
What's the best way to communicate with my ex about parenting issues?
How much should I share with my kids about the divorce process?
Key Takeaways:
Always prioritize your children's well-being over conflicts with your ex
Be mindful of your reactions and behavior, as your children will learn from your example
Consider therapy or counseling to help your children process their emotions during divorce
The conversation also touches on the importance balance of maintaining transparency with your children about age-appropriate aspects of the divorce, such as changes in finances or living arrangements. Seth, Pete, and Heather offer guidance on how to have these conversations without putting your children in the middle of adult issues.
This episode is a must-listen for anyone navigating the challenges of parenting during and after divorce. With Heather's expertise and Seth and Pete's relatable insights, you'll gain valuable tools for putting your children first and building a strong foundation for your post-divorce family.
Plus, we tackle a listener question – with Heather! – about when to file for divorce when pregnant.
Links & Notes
Find Heather on the web, LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, and YouTube
Got a question you want to ask on the show? Click here!
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Pete Wright:
Welcome everybody to How to Split a Toaster, a divorce podcast about saving your relationships from TruStory FM. Today, your toaster goes back to parenting school.
Seth Nelson:
Welcome to the show, everybody. I'm Seth Nelson, and as always, I'm here with my good friend, Pete Wright. Today, how do you help your kids navigate your divorce? That's likely a familiar question. Divorce is a test which you cannot study and you only know if you've passed it after time has passed. Today on the show, we're talking about what it takes to become a better, stronger parent during and after divorce, and we have a terrific perspective to share. Heather Brooke Quick is the founder and CEO of the only divorce and family law firm for women in Northeast, Florida; Florida's Women's Law Group in Jacksonville, Florida. She's here today to share her model for helping divorced women and men up their parenting game when it really matters. Heather, welcome to the Toaster.
Heather Quick:
Thank you both so much. I'm very happy to be here and looking forward to talking about helping our clients become better parents during the divorce.
Pete Wright:
I think it's a great question and I think as we were talking before we started recording, this whole idea that you are, as an attorney, helping parents become better parents when they are in a particularly sort of inward looking process, one that's filled with fear and uncertainty, is I think a really interesting one.
Seth Nelson:
And they're also looking at the other side, Pete, saying, "If that asshole just would stop doing that, my kids would be fine."
Pete Wright:
Right, right.
Seth Nelson:
Those are the extremes.
Heather Quick:
Yes.
Pete Wright:
So let's talk about that. How do you fashion your role in this discussion with divorcing parents and their kids?
Heather Quick:
Well, one of the ways we do for sure is really looking at the big picture, the end game, and that we're in this period of divorce for a short amount of time when depending on the age of your children, some of the things that cause so much animosity and fighting really is only going to be for a short period of time because at least in Florida at 18, they are considered adults, so the court no longer really has jurisdiction to order the parents to do anything for them. So that's one part.
And then also, the fact that you are choosing not to be married to this man anymore, but you'll always be co-parenting with him and you're always going to share this child and you got to think about that because there are graduations, there be weddings, there will be grandchildren and you're going to have to still see each other. My parents, it took them probably maybe 40 years, but they can coexist and exchange the grandchildren to help their children now. Took a long time though. I would not say they were great at our weddings.
Pete Wright:
40 years?
Heather Quick:
Okay, maybe I'll say 30. They've been divorced a long time.
Seth Nelson:
I was about to say, Heather, you're like 25. What do you mean-
Heather Quick:
I like you guys.
Seth Nelson:
... it took 40 years?
Heather Quick:
No, it was uncomfortable at my wedding, my brother's wedding, the two of them there together. But then finally, now that they have six grandchildren together, and they have of course moved on and had other spouses in the interim. But if you can heal and really forgive during that divorce process for the benefit of your children, which is probably a lot of the reason why you may be even getting the divorce right now, so that you're a better person, a better parent, maybe not married to your husband or wife.
Seth Nelson:
The old love your kids more than you hate your ex.
Heather Quick:
That's a good motto. You ought to trademark that one. That's a bumper sticker.
Seth Nelson:
Okay. Pete, let's trademark it.
Pete Wright:
Because we've been looking for merch.
Seth Nelson:
That's right, that's right.
Heather Quick:
That's a good merch. I like that one.
Seth Nelson:
But it's going to sound a little weird where it's like love your kids more than you hate your ex. That's a great bumper sticker.
Pete Wright:
Maybe we could workshop it just a little bit, maybe just the end. This is the piece that I struggle with, which is how do you remind people of just that point when what they're talking about is the contentious nature of the divorce process? How do you remind them to love their kids more than they hate their soon-to-be-former spouse?
Heather Quick:
Well, I think if you ask them, of course nobody's going to say, "No, I don't love my kids that much." Right? They are going to answer that in the affirmative. And so I think you have to walk them through, "Then what does that look like to them, this process in your behavior? How does that look if they knew what you were doing?" And keeping that in mind. But when they're in the thick of it, I think that most individuals have a difficult time, and it is a continual conversation that is worth having with your client. And also to remind them that you can only control your own behavior, but you can control the way you react to things and that's going to matter quite a bit in that your children will see that and learn from it. And that's taking the high road, which pays off down the road.
Seth Nelson:
And Pete, the reason why it's so hard is in the divorce process, so much is focused on what is the other person doing? What are you doing? And it's very easy to point blame, and sometimes pointing blame is justifiable. When someone has committed financial infidelity and you wake up in a divorce process and you're like, "What do you mean there's $150,000 in credit card debt?" You have a right to be pissed. Wait a minute, and I owe half that? You have a right to be pissed.
The question becomes how do you respond to that, especially in front of and around the children is the key. So in no way, shape, or form am I suggesting today that you don't have a right to be upset, that you don't have a right to be mad. That you don have a right to be untrusting or even it might be too early for forgiveness. We just had a whole podcast about how to give and accept apologies, and maybe there's no apology coming anytime soon, if ever. There's still ways that you can respond and deal with your former spouse in a way that puts you in the better light within your own self and then outwardly as well.
Pete Wright:
Well, I think that gets to it. You got to be able to live with yourself. However you behave, you got to be able to live with yourself. Heather, your firm is famously dedicated to women. Right?
Heather Quick:
Yes, we are.
Pete Wright:
Can you talk a little bit about the genesis of your firm? It's a divorce podcast? We try not to have particularly gendered conversations on the show, but sometimes you just have to, and this is sort of one of those things. I'm curious your perspective on how your choice to build the firm the way you built the firm fits into this question of navigating these parenting questions.
Heather Quick:
What I found early on in practice was that women will tend to give up a little bit sooner on the financial issues in their heads and in their hearts emotionally because of the kids. It usually is a way that men in my perspective can and do negotiate and try to force the hand of their spouse to maybe compromise on financial issues that otherwise they wouldn't do or that they have a right, they'll win in court. And so a big part of that is also helping these women stand up not only for themselves and understanding, "Hey, this is what you're entitled to and what you brought to the marriage is worthwhile and financially you are entitled to half of these assets, retirement. You're entitled to spousal support and child support."
Part of it, a lot of times we have conversations in regards to the parenting that, "I know that the two of you have given your children so many things, but you are now going to have limited or on a budget as far as the financial resources and you're going to have to have those kind of conversations with your children as far as what you can and cannot provide for them because I don't think they want you to lose your home because you're just trying to buy them everything."
And it's really difficult. I've just found over the years women struggle so much with they worry about their kids and will they have everything? And the other two got cars when they turned 16 and he says now he's not going to give this one a car. And it's like, "Well, but you can't control whether he does or not and allow your children to see both of you for who you are, and maybe it won't be the worst thing to let your child get a job and help contribute," and that can be very hard sometimes for our clients to wrap their head around.
Seth Nelson:
And the other thing on that too is you can't say, or I would advise people not to say, "Go ask your dad to buy the car. I can't afford it."
Heather Quick:
I agree, Seth. That is not the right thing to say.
Pete Wright:
Okay, why is that not the right thing to say? Let's just say I know. Of course, duh. But for people who don't know.
Heather Quick:
It's putting the child in the middle, one, as if they have influence, and then really what that is telling your child is, "He's a dirt bag. He's got the money, go ask him because I don't have it." And that's not the place a child should be. They're naturally, teenagers, they're going to go to each parent whether you're married or not on their own. That is just not the right response. You're just putting your child in the middle, fueling this fight. And then what if they do, and then the dad does go and buy them the car and now the child is like, "Oh, I'm going to hang out with you more often"? It doesn't work. It just can go in your favor or against you two.
Seth Nelson:
I agree with that. And the other thing it does, which is much more subtle, is when you say, "I can't afford it," right there, that teenager is going to judge where you spend your money. "I can't afford it," and then next weekend you're with dad, "I'm going on a girl's trip." Oh, you can't afford a car, but you can go on a girl's trip. So you're just setting this up. And so that also goes back to conversations we've had about money, Pete, is when you budget and you sit down with the kids.
And you can be transparent with them to the extent that you want, "This is how much I get, this is what I'm putting away for savings in retirement or I can't put away any savings in retirement right now, which is not a great financial position. I'm trying to earn more money in the future so that I can, but right now I'm trying to provide for everything and keep a lifestyle. Here it is." A lot of parents don't tell their kids what they make or what they earn or whatever. You don't have to be that specific, but you can have general conversations because until they get out on their own, they're like, "Whoa, what does a cell phone cost?"
Pete Wright:
Right.
Seth Nelson:
Right? And having those conversations earlier is better because it's going to impact them, and kids generally don't know what can be afforded and not.
Pete Wright:
Okay. I think this is a great conversation around just a culture of transparency in a divorcing family. So we're talking about, yes, I hear you, we should have more transparency about finances. Where do you both stand on transparency about the divorce process? How far into the conversation do you invite kids? Let's assume they're teenagers. What do you talk about with them in terms of the nature of the process and what's next and what's happening and those sorts of things?
Heather Quick:
From my perspective, you have to tread very, very carefully for a few reasons. One, if you're in the middle of it, that could really burn you in front of the court. And so that's another reason just for absolutely how are you going to be perceived in this matter in this trial? If you're going to be in front of the judge, then you have to walk a line and do things a very specific way and do not involve the children. Do not talk to them about this. Do not allow them to think they are going to be able to choose who they're going to be with or that they have any part in the proceedings. The court, if the judge were to find out about that and we're dealing with time sharing, which is what we call custody here in Florida, it can go very badly against you.
The judge will really reprimand you. So that is for the number one reason, right? Just for your own self-interest., just don't do it when we're in the proceeding. But also, I think they're children and I don't think you should include them in the details and in the muck. I think I've told this to many clients, I think I'm sure Seth would agree, your child comes from both of you. So if you're talking about their dad badly, well, that's part of them, so then what do you think about them? Especially the kids who look like their parents. It's very destructive and I don't think that you should talk badly about your child's parent to them within the divorce. I think maybe on a surface.
Seth Nelson:
I would agree with everything that Heather said, Pete. The only thing because saying teenagers, so they know that you're going through a divorce. They know that the case hasn't settled. They have friends whose parents have gone to trial. They might have friends who parents have gone to trial with you as their lawyer. So what I do advocate carefully, tread lightly. When a child asks you, "When are you just going to be done? Can't you guys just get it settled?" Then it's, "We're doing the best that we can. We both love you. These are difficult decisions. It's not always clear what's best." "Well, when's it going to be done?" "I wish I knew." Right? Or, "Dad and I, we can't decide, so the judge is going to decide, and that is scheduled for June."
And if I'm cross-examining a witness, "Did you ever talk to your kid about this?" "Yes." "Well, what did you say?" "I told him that these are really difficult issues and sometimes we can't tell what's best, and your dad and I have to have the judge decide and that it was scheduled in June," I don't think a judge is going to jump up and down about that answer when you're talking to a 16-year-old. Who knows? Right? "Well, how did this come up?" "Well-
Pete Wright:
They're curious. They're kids.
Seth Nelson:
... he was asking about whether he can afford to go to homecoming, so it impacts him." But to keep it at that broad brush stroke level as opposed to, "Well, it could have been settled if dad would've accepted our offer that my lawyer says is fabulous and this lawyer isn't responding. And included was that is the big hiccup, is that under Florida law you don't have to pay for college. But I told dad, he really needs to pay for half your college." That's probably a bad answer.
Pete Wright:
No, that's not it. Right. Well, I think this underscores the fine line that you're walking when you are talking about role modeling great parental behavior for your kids. You want to be honest and authentic. I read stories about people talking about divorce online and editorializing about how, "We need to be radically transparent because you're not just divorced as a couple, you're divorcing a family, right? This affects everybody. You got to be honest," and maybe you can be honest and your response doesn't have to include, "It'll be over when your daddy stops being an asshole."
Heather Quick:
Right. Exactly. I agree exactly with what Seth said as well.
Seth Nelson:
Twice, Pete. Talented lawyer agreed with me twice already on the show. I'm just letting you know, and yes, I'm keeping score.
Pete Wright:
No, I get it. Everybody gets it, Seth.
Heather Quick:
Because your kids know what's going on. They're smart. Of course they're going to ask, but you just don't want to divulge the details. And when we started the show, we talked about what we can tell our clients on how to behave during the litigation. In Florida, we have the Sunshine Laws so their children can get access and read everything that has been filed in the divorce, so that's another point to bring up when there's an issue. One, is this something that's going to move the needle for you, and do you really want this in the record? Do we want this in the record when one day your children get on the internet and figure it out? Because it's not if, it's just when.
Pete Wright:
Of course. Well, in the spirit of divorce being a team sport, how do you recommend and how do you guide your clients toward dealing with resources to support the kids, like getting them a counselor, a therapist to help them work through some of these issues? How does that work for you?
Heather Quick:
Oh, all the time. It is so important and really in the environment where all adolescents are right now, they probably need a therapist whether you're going through a divorce or not, just to get through that time. But most ages of the children, once they are about over 10 and/or if they're struggling, at least give them an opportunity to have a safe space to speak. And often also as well, I'll have clients and the child's mad at the father and the child doesn't want to go with him, and it becomes very important to involve the therapist with the child to help nurture that relationship because again, I mean the court's going to want to order that, but it's really important for your child because they are going to be spending almost half their time with their father. And if there are issues and whatever they are thinking in their head and maybe things that you had said or that they've just witnessed in the household prior to the divorce and separation, that therapy, I don't really see a downside to it. We strongly advocate that for our clients to have their children there.
Seth Nelson:
And the hard part, not really that hard, is one way is to figure out do they need it? Do they not? Do they want it? And I'm a big advocate of mental health check-ins with the parent. And literally it can be as simple as when you tell them that you're getting divorced, and we've had conversations on how to do that, Pete, but when you tell them that, you tell them, "We're going to be checking in with you to see how you're doing during this process. It's change. Change can be difficult. One day you could be doing great, the next day, maybe not. Maybe five minutes ago, you're doing great, now you're not."
So I'm a big advocate of, "One to 10, how are you feeling?" It just lays it out. "Oh, I'm about a six." "Okay. Anything you want to talk about? Anything I can do to help, anything I can try to do to help?" So those little check-ins, like, "How are you sleeping at night? I noticed you're not very motivated to practice piano the way you used to be. Anything going on with piano?" This one to 10 stuff to me, everyone understands it, they know what the question is and it gives them a simple answer. "I'm a six." "Do you want to talk about that more?" "Nope. I'm just a sex." "Okay, let's move on." And it's good when you have them trapped in the car.
Heather Quick:
Yes, that is the best time.
Pete Wright:
Traps are great. I think parents know traps are the best. All of this sounds really healthy and fantastic. What happens when you're dealing with a couple that is clearly on the road to parallel parenting? They can't have these conversations and there is no transparency about what's going on at dad's house versus mom's house because they can't talk anymore.
Heather Quick:
From my perspective, it's really difficult and I know that obviously it's going to impact the children. We certainly try to give our clients the tools. There's all the apps, I'm sure you guys have talked about it, where they can use the apps to communicate, which is OurFamilyWizard and TalkingParents, there's a million of them. But we've got to give them tools. And we have some high conflict counseling and parenting coordinators and they end up spending an awful lot of money with others to assist them in communicating, but sometimes that's the only way. You can't get through to them. But you've got to try to set up these tools that are available to try to help make it better. And going back to therapy and mental health, again, they can control how they respond, and I try to talk to our clients about that. "Listen, I know you're mad. He's an asshole, he's not doing this, but you don't have to respond that way. That's your choice and you can control that, and you really need to get ahold of that."
Seth Nelson:
And sometimes Heather, do you find this? They like responding inappropriately.
Heather Quick:
I do. I think yes.
Seth Nelson:
And here's why, Pete. They're finally out from under the guy's thumb, just hypothetically here, and it's the first time they're actually being able to find their own voice. It feels good, right?
Heather Quick:
It does. And to tell them what you really think and to really let it out, but you got to move on. Eventually, it's like you have to move on with your life. And I don't know, I'm really big into you can choose to be a victim. Not that you're not victimized and things can happen, but there becomes a point where you need to start taking responsibility and grow through it, move through it, and for your own benefit as well as your children. But those can be difficult conversations. Not everyone is willing to do the work and to let it go.
Seth Nelson:
You got to meet your client where they are, and sometimes they're just not ready for it.
Heather Quick:
They're not ready. So we just try to get them through it as unscathed as possible, try to get them into some therapy, at least for the children. You know the children are suffering because the two of them are fighting so much.
Pete Wright:
Well, and that's why I think these extremes are illustrative, right? Because I think just hearing you talk about the behavior that you as divorcing parents exert in the world and how that is reflected upon your kids, what are they learning from everything you do throughout the day?
Seth Nelson:
And this isn't just divorcing parents. I know that's how we've kind of framed this. This is true whether you got kids or not on how you respond. It's true on how you decide to treat yourself. Do you want to live in this space or do you want to lower your expectations like, "I know I'm going to send this email. I'm just asking about dividing up personal property. I just have my list and I'm going to be very nice and brief and I would like these items. Please let me know whether or not you want any of these items and if you do, I'm happy to discuss it. Try to work something out." Something very nice. "You know fucking damn well that I want these properties. You only put them on your list because you know that. And that gift was really from my parents to me, and you're claiming it was from them to us and it's really non-marital. And I just love that wagon wheel table."
Pete Wright:
Coffee table. I love the wagon wheel coffee table.
Seth Nelson:
You know it's coming, and so you get tense and you brace for it and you want to fight back. And so just say, "I know it's going to be just paragraphs of crap and I'm going to read it once and I'm going to see if there's any nugget in there that I'm able to respond to that's dealing with the issue." And sometimes the answer's just no, there's not, and you just let it go by. Heather, is that right? See, I'm going for number three, Pete.
Pete Wright:
I know. Here we go.
Heather Quick:
Yes, that's right. He's right. I'm so sorry, Pete. I'm so sorry. We'll have to do a show where you can be right.
Pete Wright:
I know, just something. It unfortunately won't be about the law. Well, I think it's fascinating and I think if there's any message from this conversation, it's like look at your behavior and how it reflects on your kids, and this idea of what it looks like to become a stronger, better parent. If we go back to how we started, what does the end result look like when you've gotten through the divorce process? What kind of a parent do you want to be when it's done? Can you paint that picture? What does it look like?
Heather Quick:
Absolutely. And you can paint that for them and say, "All right, well, there are going to be gatherings and don't make your children responsible for coordinating mom's going to come over and then dad, no. Try to be the grownups, which you are, and let your children grow into healthy adults that when it's their graduation, it can be about them and not about the fight between the two of you, or they've got to split time." Because during the divorce and when they're minors, it's mom's time, it's dad's time. Holidays are split, everything is split. But once they become an adult, they very likely may choose not to do that. And certainly when they have their own family, they're like, "No. You want to come? This is when is happening. You two will have to be together and you better get along." And that's helpful I think for people to understand because this window of the divorce, particularly when your children are minors, is such a small part of their life, and how much of a negative impact are you going to have on them from this when you don't have to that'll go on?
Seth Nelson:
And you can practice this. And we've talked about this before, Pete, but you can practice this. You can send a text and say, "Johnny's got a game tonight. I know that we're having difficult times between us. If it's okay with you, I would like to sit next to you so when Johnny looks at us, we're sitting next to each other. I will respect your privacy. I won't talk to you. I won't mention the divorce. I am simply there so when he looks up at the field, he just sees us both and he doesn't have to decide who he looks for when and how long.
And I respect if you say no, if you say no, my intention is to sit five to 10 rows behind you, so at least I'm in the line of sight if he does that, and then they can say yes or no." And you can say, "At the end of the game, it's my time with him. I'll be picking him up. Take as much time as you want with him after the game. I'll get my hugs after you leave. There's ways to do that, that then if they respond, "Fuck you, I'm not sitting next to you," first off, that's great. That's like manna from heaven that divorce attorneys love. Right?
Heather Quick:
That's true. Yes.
Seth Nelson:
Heather lit up. She's like, "Is it Christmas already in May?"
Heather Quick:
The only thing's better is if it's a voicemail, where you actually get to hear the tone of their voice saying that. That is the only thing better than that, but yes, absolutely.
Seth Nelson:
So there's things you can do like that. And like you say, everything right in that. Now you got to show up and do it because if you do that and then you start talking about the divorce and she gets out the phone and says, "I'm recording you. We're in public, I'm allowed to do this," and you say, "I don't give a fuck if you record me. You can tell it to the judge," Oh, don't worry. We will.
Pete Wright:
We'll tell it to the judge. Okay.
Heather Quick:
Yes, indeed.
Pete Wright:
Well, it's fraught waters to sail here. This is really, really hard. And so for those listening who might be going through this, we're so sorry. It is challenging. It's really, really hard. But just remember, keep it in the back of your head, as frustrated as you are, remember what those kids are going through. Remember what they're seeing that they might not be saying because that stuff matters.
Seth Nelson:
And it wasn't their fault.
Pete Wright:
It wasn't their fault.
Seth Nelson:
They did nothing. You got to own some part of the relationship that didn't work. And even if it was all the other person's fault and you didn't do anything, let's say you have someone with mental illness or addiction and you've done everything you can, it's not their fault.
Heather Quick:
Right.
Seth Nelson:
It might not be yours either, it's certainly not theirs.
Pete Wright:
Definitely not theirs.
Heather Quick:
And you do have to constantly remind them of that and reassure your children because as much of the emotions you're feeling, and fear and anxiety, theirs is 10 time worst because they have no input. They really don't know what's going on, they're children. So you have such a responsibility to reassure them, calm them, and try to keep it together in front of your kids because you brought them into this world. You made this choice to have children and now, whether you chose the divorce or not, it is happening and you should really take that responsibility seriously to protect them and help them so that maybe they don't end up going through that or they learn better behaviors because now you're showing them a better way to act and interact with somebody.
Seth Nelson:
And part of that too is, as Heather knows and Pete, you know in Florida, we have now a presumption of 50/50 timesharing, as Heather said, custody visitation. But at the front end, the kids don't get to decide whether they go to the other parent or not. So there's going to be apprehension and they might say, "Oh, I want to stay here more." Well, if you can talk to your spouse and say, "Look, they're being reluctant. Here's what I'm doing at my house, and let's talk about some quality time they can spend, even if it's not the same amount of quantity time." Try to solve these problems in real time and stop going, "Well, it's my time, it's my time, it's my time." Where I see parents actually work well together on this is when they have three and four kids because they have to work together because they can't get them all to all the activities. And those are the parents that might be having a lot of financial issues or infidelity issues or this issue or that issue, but usually they're saying, "We're doing pretty good with the kids stuff."
Pete Wright:
Schedules are dope, right? They've got that locked.
Seth Nelson:
Locked. Maybe the kids never want to go spend the night at mom's or spend the night at dad's, but getting them to and from, they're like, "Oh yeah, we got it." They have to. There's really no other choice.
Pete Wright:
All right. Good lessons, good conversation. Thank you so much, Heather, for hanging out with us. Before we transition to our next thing, you want to tell people a little bit more about where to find you?
Heather Quick:
Yes, absolutely. So our firm, Florida Women's Law Group, we are located in Jacksonville, Florida, as well as St. John's County, Florida, so really the northeastern quadrant of Florida. We represent women only in divorce and family law issues.
Pete Wright:
Outstanding. We'll put the website in the show notes. You've got a lot of awesome stuff going on at the firm. We're we're really glad to be able to share what you do up there in Jacksonville.
Heather Quick:
Well, thank you. And just for the women listeners, I do have a podcast, Women Winning Divorce.
Seth Nelson:
And for the guys listening, listen. Tune in.
Pete Wright:
Really. Come on.
Seth Nelson:
She's giving you all the secrets on what you're not supposed to do.
Pete Wright:
That's right.
Heather Quick:
Yep. We are in our second year and really had great response and hoping to provide valuable content. So yes, it is applicable, but obviously geared towards women. But it's great.
Seth Nelson:
That's the difference, Pete. She's trying to get applicable content that's really good on her show and we're just-
Pete Wright:
Why is she here? Why did she come to talk to us?
Seth Nelson:
Because they're listening to our show. Oh, let's go get some quality over there.
Pete Wright:
All right. Well, we have a bit of a slightly precedented, maybe unprecedented transition here. We're going to talk about a listener question.
Seth Nelson:
So Heather, we didn't prep you for this.
Heather Quick:
Oh, okay.
Seth Nelson:
We have listener questions, and this is how it works with me. I don't see them before the show, so you and I are in the same boat on this question. Are you up for the challenge?
Heather Quick:
Oh, I'm up. I'm up for it.
Seth Nelson:
Let's do it, Pete.
Pete Wright:
It's unprecedented because we have two attorneys, they're both Florida attorneys, and we have a question from an anonymous listener who is in Florida. This is the trifecta. It's huge. Here we go. "I'm worried I might be pregnant. Should I file immediately? Anything I should consider? My mom says Florida divorce and pregnancy law is hardcore somehow." That's the end of the question. What makes Florida divorce and pregnancy law hardcore in this specific scenario?
Seth Nelson:
And the listener wants to know whether she should file immediately.
Pete Wright:
Yes.
Seth Nelson:
So I'm guessing she's a woman because pregnant, and therefore we'll have Heather represent her and I'll be the other side.
Heather Quick:
Okay.
Seth Nelson:
All right, Heather, you go first.
Heather Quick:
There is nothing to file as the child has not been born yet, so as far as a paternity action, which will be what would need to be filed. And some things she needs to consider and understand is what is the relationship with the father and is he aware? Is he involved? Does he want any part of this? Recently the law changed in Florida in regards to paternity, and now you can be recognized legally as the father if the correct paperwork is executed after the birth of the child. It used to be you have to go to court to establish paternity, but usually women are going to court to establish child support and then therefore, the father shows up to defend that and request time sharing.
Now, I'll just agree with the mother on hardcore. Not to get on a tangent, I won't go crazy here on that, but obviously you don't have to be married, but if you have a child with somebody, they're going to pretty much get 50/50. And even before the law changed, I found judges were more inclined to grant fathers 50% of the time to unmarried couples. It was really weird. So you're going to be handing over basically your newborn, even if you're breastfeeding, nursing, to that father every other day. And that to me seems hardcore for a child, an infant to be taken from his mother.
Pete Wright:
That does sound hardcore. That sounds hardcore to me.
Heather Quick:
Yeah.
Seth Nelson:
That's because the Ten-Year doctrine, which was, "Well, if kids are little, they should be with Mom," was abolished many, many years ago in Florida. So I agree with everything Heather said. And here's the other thing, Pete. The way I first heard the question was that it was an unmarried person because she says, "I'm pregnant, and pregnancy law is hardcore." To lawyers, that sounds like they're not married. I have the benefit of seeing the question that Pete just put up on our screen. We have a little screen that we can see that Heather can't.
And it also says, "My mom says Florida divorce and pregnancy law is hardcore." So if it's a divorce case, I would say, "Well, you may want to file, you may not." Where it gets tricky, which I am not assuming that this nice woman, Anonymous, did this, but if that child is not your husband's, there could be other issues because there is a presumption that a child born of the marriage is the father, is the husband. So that creates other host of hardcore somehow problems. Right?
Pete Wright:
Right, right.
Seth Nelson:
But I would say you need to go talk to a lawyer in your local area that is qualified in your jurisdiction because you've got a lot of good questions that need to be answered. And if you're in Jacksonville or in North Florida, there's this great lawyer, Heather Quick.
Pete Wright:
Check the show notes.
Heather Quick:
That's right.
Pete Wright:
Right in there because you're in the sweet spot.
Seth Nelson:
And if you're in Tampa, there's this great lawyer, Heather Quick, in Jacksonville.
Pete Wright:
This is outstanding. Thank you, Heather, for submitting yourself to this grueling line of inquiry. We sure appreciate you being here for the whole parts of the show, all of the show. This was great. Thank you everybody for downloading and listening to the show. Don't forget, you can submit your very own question at Howtosplittatoaster.com. There's a button, it just says, "Ask a question," and we'll answer it just like we did to Anonymous here. We'll call her Ann Nonymous. And we would love to address your question on the show too. So on behalf of Seth Nelson and Heather Quick, both America's favorite divorce attorneys. Who knew?
Seth Nelson:
Oh man.
Pete Wright:
I'm Pete Wright.
Seth Nelson:
Pete, that's a dagger to the heart.
Pete Wright:
You're doing fine. You're doing fine. I'm Pete Wright. We'll see you next week, right here on How to Split a Toaster, a divorce podcast about saving your relationships.
Outro:
How to Split a Toaster is part of the TruStory FM podcast network, produced by Andy Nelson. Music by T. Bless & the Professionals and DB studios. Seth Nelson is an attorney with NLG Divorce & Family Law with offices in Tampa, Florida. While we may be discussing family law topics, How to Split a Toaster is not intended to, nor is it providing legal advice. Every situation is different. If you have specific questions regarding your situation, please seek your own legal counsel with an attorney licensed to practice law in your jurisdiction. Pete Wright is not an attorney or employee of NLG Divorce & Family Law. Seth Nelson is licensed to practice law in Florida.
