Finding Hope When You Feel Like an Impostor: Combating Impostor Syndrome with Lauren Abrams

WHEN YOU FEEL LIKE AN IMPOSTOR

Today, we’re talking about impostor syndrome and your divorce. What does it mean to see yourself as an impostor? You’ll start to doubt your own abilities and decisions. You’ll struggle when it’s time to assert your own rights and needs. You’ll find you lack confidence in negotiating and making decisions. This week, attorney and fellow podcaster Lauren Abrams joins us to tell her story of 52 weeks of hope, and how overcoming impostor syndrome can lead to freedom from stress, anxiety, and fear. 


The first step is noticing the negative self-talk. There are other tools we discuss – journaling, meditating, and more. But it’s hard to work through this. So tune in to this week’s show to get some thoughts on ways to combat this if you’re finding you feel like an impostor as you’re dealing with your own divorce.


Links & Notes

  • Pete Wright:

    Welcome to How To Split a Toaster, a divorce podcast about saving your relationships on TruStoryFM. Today, what happens when your toaster isn't good enough?

    Seth Nelson:

    Welcome to the show everybody. I'm Seth Nelson. As always, I'm here with my good friend Pete Wright. Today we're talking about imposter syndrome in your divorce. What does it mean to see yourself as an imposter? You start to doubt your own abilities and decisions. You'll struggle when it's time to assert your own rights and needs. You'll find you lack confidence in negotiating and making decisions. This week, attorney and fellow podcaster, Lauren Abrams joins us to tell her story of 52 Weeks of Hope and how overcoming imposter syndrome can lead to freedom from stress, anxiety, and fear. Lauren, welcome to the toaster.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Thank you so much. It's great to be here.

    Pete Wright:

    We're so glad you're here and I feel like this is a good conversation because you're a lawyer and a podcaster. That's very exciting.

    Seth Nelson:

    Sounds strangely familiar.

    Pete Wright:

    It's weirdly familiar. It's eerie. Eerie, silence in the room. I want to talk about how you feel about yourself can impact your divorce, and you actually had brought this question to talk about imposter syndrome and how living in this state of imposter syndrome can impact the way your divorce plays out. Can you introduce us to the topic and kick us off?

    Lauren Abrams:

    Sure. Well, imposter syndrome is when you feel like you're a fake or a fraud, like you're going to get found out. It's really fear and you have to feel the feelings. If you don't feel your feelings, it's going to come out someplace else and it could come out just like stress. It's going to come out in your body someplace. There's all kinds of studies and everything else that show that if you don't feel your feelings, it just will, it'll come out in some other manner.

    Seth Nelson:

    And usually in a negative manner. Right, Lauren?

    Lauren Abrams:

    Yes, definitely.

    Seth Nelson:

    It's never a healthy manner.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Oh no, definitely not. It's stuffing your feelings, all that stuff. I mean, I didn't grow up talking about my feelings. I mean, I still have to Google feelings list and go, yes, that one, sometimes.

    Pete Wright:

    Well, here's the thing. When you talk about imposter syndrome, this whole idea of feeling like an imposter, when you start to doubt your own abilities, you doubt your own ability to exist in your skin and do the things that are being asked of you. I look at, first of all, just in the space of vulnerability for the two of you, I have never looked at a lawyer and said, man, I'll bet they really feel imposter syndrome at any given point. It feels like if you really are able to internalize imposter syndrome, you don't become a lawyer. I mean, do you guys feel that way?

    Lauren Abrams:

    That's such a good question because I can remember practicing a good 10 years walking down a corridor of a courtroom and thinking, look at all these people. They think I'm a lawyer. I am a lawyer. I went to good law schools. I put myself through school, and yet I think I've got them fooled. Like what? Even when I started my podcast a couple years ago, I can remember being on a Zoom for a legal reason and thinking all those little squares, you can tell when people are on their phone and two little squares talking to each other. I think they're talking to each other, who knows who they're talking to. And I'm like, they're thinking about me. They're talking to each other, they're going, did you hear? Lauren started a podcast. Who does she think she is starting a podcast?

    When I became that person thinking people are talking about me and everything else, that's imposter syndrome. And eventually I realized nobody's talking about me. Nobody cares that I started a podcast and it has nothing to do with my legal profession by the way at all. Nobody is talking about you at all. You have to feel the feeling, walk through it and keep going. So the whole thing with a divorce, I mean, I'm sure Seth will talk about this more than anyone else when you think, well, I won't be able to do that. Yes, you can.

    Seth Nelson:

    On that point, Pete, I'm going to let out a big secret here.

    Pete Wright:

    Do it.

    Seth Nelson:

    People in the general public think lawyers are smart. I assure you that is not always the case. If you want to be a lawyer, there is a law school that will take your money and you will go to law school and then you will take a bar exam prep course and you'll pass the bar.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Well, I could top that. People think judges are smart. My biggest disappointment in law was judges.

    Pete Wright:

    That's fascinating. Well, I think that's really important and I think it's important to get it out early that what we're talking about here is not a legal thing. It's not an inferiority thing. It's a human thing.

    Lauren Abrams:

    So I've written a lot about it. There's a quiz on my website. I don't think you need a quiz. You know when you've got it, you feel like you're going to get found out. It's a feeling. Michelle Obama talks about it, Meryl Streep said no matter what movie she made, every time she'd make a new movie, she thought, now they're going to find out I can't act. Maya Angelou used to talk about it when she was alive. I mean, very high performing women talk openly about it. Sheryl Sandberg in her book, she talked about it. You're in a very good quality of people if you're feeling like that.

    Pete Wright:

    Yeah. So my question then comes down to from your perspectives, how does imposter syndrome, how can you as a divorcing couple let's say or divorcing individual, how can imposter syndrome impact your divorce and what you're trying to accomplish?

    Lauren Abrams:

    I mean, I think it would come into play into anything you're doing.

    Seth Nelson:

    Where I see it, Pete, there will be some clients that are doing everything they can just to juggle everything. And usually that would be moms. Okay, they're trying to work, trying to get the kids. There's all these social pressures on them. I think women do a great job, generally speaking, supporting each other. There's more support groups in our space talking about divorce. There's a lot more female voices than male voices. But also I think generally speaking that sometimes women will then judge women more harshly than guys will judge guys. Guys are like, whatever, he's an idiot, and they move on. Okay, so how does this play into imposter syndrome? When they're juggling it all, they're like, oh my God, if I go to court, they're going to find out that I really can't handle all this shit. Or maybe I am, am I a bad mom? I'm trying to be a good mom. I'm doing this. I'm doing PTA, I'm going to all the events, I'm packing the lunches, I'm packing the orange peels for breaks at practice, I'm doing all the homework, or kids need therapy, I'm getting there.

    Maybe I really can't handle it. Maybe I'm just going through the motions and I'm doing what I'm supposed to do, but deep down, maybe I'm not a good mom. Maybe it's because the dad keeps saying that she's doing it all wrong all the time, right? So she doesn't feel like she can do it. I'm going to get found out. And we all know, oh yeah, we're going to court, I'm going to air that dirty laundry. And people think that people just sit there all day and look through the court file about all the bad shit that people say about each other. And I tell people, people don't even know how to find it. And if they did, they don't care. And if they really tried to get it, they've got to go down to a courthouse because in Hillsborough County in Florida, most of these records are confidential, you can't just pull them offline necessarily. Some you can, some you can't.

    So that's where I see a lot of it. Am I going to get deposed? They're going to find out I'm not as good as I'm saying I'm going to be. Am I going to have to go to court? They're going to find out. What am I going to tell my lawyer about this? Because if I tell my lawyer, oh my God, is he going to represent me? Is she going to represent me if they know that I don't think I'm that good? Well, how does that play? It's so fear based. I see it a lot in how it manifests itself in really different ways depending on the client and their situation.

    Lauren Abrams:

    You have to tell your lawyer everything because a lawyer can't be blindsided.

    Pete Wright:

    Yeah. Yeah. Well, and this gets to my curiosity around some of the impacts of living in this space of uncertainty as a potential client is how it can be paralyzing. It can paralyze you and stall you in being able to what? Negotiate through mediation to make decisions in a timely manner to support your own case. It feels like all of these things, like the emotional weight of your own self-image of just waiting to be found out can really stall the process.

    Seth Nelson:

    Yeah. And I'm going to flip the coin on this now. Take the guy that owns his own business and he's doing well and he's buying flashy stuff. And a lot of that is because it's a materialistic society. That's what he's into, whatever. But it's also like, oh my God, I'm going to get found out because my business isn't as good. It's going to go down. Now every single judge on every single divorce case has always heard the guy that owns the business, the business is on its way down. It's never going up in a divorce. No one comes and say, judge, I pocketed 12 million, but next year we're going to hit 20. No one says that, right? They say 12 million was an anomaly, judge. We couldn't believe it. We're going to be down to three if we're lucky next year. But part of those guys, when they're making more money than they could ever imagine, they think, how am I here? The charade is going to come off. I'm going to lose it all.

    And now you're asking this guy to pay X number of dollars in alimony because under the law, that's what he's required to pay. But he's like, it's an illusion. It's all going to go away. And I tell him, well, if it goes away we can come back and modify. So it works in all different interesting ways, and that's part of being the council at law to figure out where people's fears are and how do you discuss those fears? Because we're making a deal today that could go on for a very long time and things change over time.

    Pete Wright:

    I'm paralyzed just thinking about it, trying to empathize through it because how do you... This is something we've talked about on the show in the past. Part of what it takes to get over this particular hump is being able to develop a new set of muscles under stress and anxiety and fear. And those are the muscles that tell you, hey, right now I need to live in fact and truth. I need to live in only what I know to be true and not the story that I'm telling myself about it. How do you develop that muscle? Now I know Lauren, in your sort of background, you overcome your own sort of stories there. What can you learn through, and maybe you want to introduce 52 Weeks of Hope at this point, what can you teach us about developing that new set of muscles to be able to respond under stress and anxiety and do so authentically and clearly?

    Lauren Abrams:

    And that's where all the tools of... Because you've probably, if you're getting divorced, you've been hearing what a piece of shit you are, you're no good. I mean, you've been fighting, right? And you've probably been hearing it for a while. So hopefully you do have really good girlfriends or guys. I mean, I actually have interviewed certain men and they need support groups, men really do. It's so true what you were saying, Seth, that the guys guys are like, yeah, get over it or whatever.

    I mean, I interviewed a relationship coach, especially during the pandemic on lockdown when he was saying, the girls need to give the guys a break. They want to marry you on the second date for a reason. They have no one at all and they have no one to talk to. Because I was asking him how he was doing with his guy groups. He goes, "What? Are you kidding? My wife has book clubs, she has PTA, she has this, she has that." He goes, "I'm with the kids." And that's when it got a little bit dark. He was talking about the guys have nothing and the girls, they talk about everything and they move on.

    Pete Wright:

    It's sort of natural, like naturally fostering community.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Yeah, it's so true. I like to think that next generations, the guys aren't like that. I see my son and they seem to talk a lot more, but I don't know. It depends on the person. Anyway, there's a lot of tools you can do. One really simple which is affirmations, you feel like an SNL skit, but really looking in the mirror and telling yourself how great you are, it works. There's a reason people do it. It goes back to Louise Hay is what I know it from looking in the mirror and saying, I love you. I'm great. I am a worthy person. It may sound however it sounds, but they work.

    Seth Nelson:

    Well, let's talk about that. I like to hit these uncomfortable stuff where people say, really does that work? It works. It's okay to give yourself compliments. You will beat yourself up all the time over stuff that you are being critical of yourself on. And I don't know why I keep saying that, the flip side of the coin today, but the flip side of that coin is then why is it weird to give yourself a compliment?

    Lauren Abrams:

    That's such a good point. I'm going to steal that. You know what? I've never actually said that. I talk about affirmations all the time. I never talk about how it's okay. I mean, the negative stuff-

    Seth Nelson:

    Lauren, Pete's skin is crawling. When you compliment something I say, Pete hates it.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Sorry, Pete.

    Pete Wright:

    It does. But you know what? That's 100% projection because as you're talking about this, I realize how shitty I am at taking compliments. I can't do it. So how could I possibly give myself a compliment? I can't stand it when other people talk about me like that. Right?

    Lauren Abrams:

    For the next 24 hours, see if you can give yourself 10 compliments. But it's looking in the mirror and not saying, oh, I have wrinkles here next to my eyes. It's not looking at, for me, my hair.

    Pete Wright:

    It's like, why is my skin stained like that? That's weird.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Sun spots?

    Pete Wright:

    Yeah, I can do that all day long.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Yeah, it's none of that. It's looking in your eye out loud saying, I love you. I am a worthy person. Whatever it is, wherever you need. And first you have to notice the negative self talk. It's really important, the first stuff is noticing the negative self talk.

    Seth Nelson:

    I started doing this on small stuff. I mean, I wouldn't even say I'm worthy. These kind of what I would say generalized statements. I would say stuff like, man, that was a really nice omelet I made my son today. It's that simple as it is. And I would ask him, "How was the omelet?" He's like, "Dad, it was really good." And I would think to myself, that was a good omelet. I made a good omelet. I mean, I remember this from years and years and years ago when he was little and I was trying to put nice food on the table because I wasn't a good cook. I hadn't really cooked, I hadn't learned to cook. But every meal I put on that plate for that kid, and he was three and a half, four years old, I made it look fun. I would cut up the apples and put it around the outside of the dish. It's just cut up apples.

    And I was always trying to do a nice presentation and I'd say, look, this might be mac and cheese on the inside and apples around the outside, but I made it look nice and I would compliment myself because I was learning how to one, get a kid to eat, which is a struggle in and of itself, but being a dad that was taking care of a three-year-old and I was like, okay, I'm on. Got to put on meals on the table. So giving those little compliments to yourself I think help build my own confidence and realize I can do this.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Absolutely. So affirmations is a simple way. Journaling to get to five minutes even. Five minutes. Why are you guys laughing?

    Pete Wright:

    Because I love journaling and Seth is a noted antagonist.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Okay. I mean, the best tools of all are journaling and meditation. So I'm just going to get those out right away. If you guys want to laugh, go.

    Pete Wright:

    No, no, I'm all on board that train.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Journaling and meditation are the best tools of all. People will say, well, why do you meditate? And I say, because no matter what's going on, it gets you okay with everything going on, even if it's five minutes a day, although I have a whole thing. If meditation and exercise are the things that the endorphins... Nothing makes me feel better than exercise and meditation. So I don't understand why I don't do them 20 times a day, but I don't.

    Pete Wright:

    Seth, you meditate, right? You've done some meditation.

    Seth Nelson:

    I have.

    Pete Wright:

    Okay. So just the journaling that doesn't work for you, and I unfairly characterize you for the joke, but I know you're not much of a journaler. But it's not like you don't have a mindfulness practice yourself.

    Seth Nelson:

    Well, yeah, I would appreciate that. But I did do a journal entry about meditation.

    Pete Wright:

    So yeah, that actually counts as two.

    Seth Nelson:

    Right.

    Pete Wright:

    That's good.

    Seth Nelson:

    No, so Lauren, our laughter is that Pete's an excellent writer and he enjoys journaling. He really believes it, and that's just not how I get my emotions out. And so that's why we were laughing. But we certainly agree that it's a great form of exercising your brain and to get things out and emotionally it's very healthy for you. I'm not dissing, I'm just saying it's not my thing.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Yeah.

    Pete Wright:

    I'm want to just add one thing to journaling. In terms of a journaling practice, and I'm thinking about it because of the subject of imposter syndrome and developing muscles, developing these new sort of emotional muscles takes practice and there's something too. When I started using a template, I have this little keystroke template tool that I just type a few keystrokes and it gives me essentially a list of questions to answer every day. Just three questions that I can address every day. So I'm not completely free forming it. I can actually put some thought into the things that are giving me trouble today. And if I'm living in a space of imposter syndrome, I can really see the benefit of saying, how are you showing up authentically? Giving yourself that compliment of the day in the form of a journal to see how you trend over time.

    I'm huge on tracking trends. I love seeing that about myself. I wear the Apple Watch, I do the thing, I track the health data, I track the meditation data. I love that stuff. And there is really something to watching yourself through the artifact of your past journals develop the ability to talk to yourself more effectively over time. Is that making any sense at all?

    Lauren Abrams:

    It made total sense, completely. And if somebody isn't journaling and you want to get to the truth of something, write a question at the top of the page and then hand write it out. They say handwriting is going straight from the heart through the pen to the paper to get to your answer. So that's a good way to get just to your truth. If you're beating yourself up and you need to get some self-worth, the truth is you're great and if there's something you really want to do, everyone has their own unique hand print. Nobody can do what you can do the way you can do it. So the imposter syndrome, it's not true. Anytime you're going to start doing something new, be it be a divorced parent or go after some goal or dream you really want to do, imposter syndrome's going to rear its ugly head and tell you who do you think you are doing that at some point. And so you have to feel it and then walk through it and have people around you saying, oh no, you've got this. You want those people, not your ex.

    Pete Wright:

    Not your ex. Right. According to the National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism, about 10% of children live with a parent with an alcohol use disorder. Seth?

    Seth Nelson:

    It's horrible and we've talked about it before, though what do we do about this, especially in the divorce case? We want to make sure that your children are safe and with a sober parent, but we also want to help the child maintain a positive relationship with both parents. You don't want one parent quizzing the child about what happens at the other parent's house. Was he drinking? Was she drinking? What's going on? So how do we balance one of the hardest thing in navigating the divorce and a custody litigation? Soberlink.

    Pete Wright:

    What is Soberlink? Soberlink is a device, it looks like a breathalyzer, but it's more than a breathalyzer. It measures your alcohol in your system at just the right time when you are about to drive with your kids, when you're doing the drop-offs, when you're doing carpool, whatever the case, if you want to share real-time data of your experience and not experience with alcohol at just the right time, you use Soberlink. Little device, it has a facial recognition camera on it so it absolutely knows that it's you blowing into the device when you blow into it. There are two models. One is cellular, so it can just send your data off without the need of a cell phone. The other is a Bluetooth connection to your phone. It requires your phone to work. Either case, you're getting real-time data about your use of alcohol when you need it.

    Seth Nelson:

    And that data goes straight to your co-parent. So if you blow into that device and it comes up that you have blood alcohol content higher than you're supposed to have or any at all, they're allowed to come get the kids. Why? Keep them safe. But more importantly, when you blow into that device and it shows 0.00, that's going to hold up in court. You're going to say, look, I'm with my kids, I'm not drinking. And then you're going to move forward and do what's really important, and that's spending time with the kids. So you can sign up, receive $50 off your device, just visit soberlink.com/toaster. We really appreciate Soberlink sponsoring this show. There is a body of people that individually, when you talk to them, they will tell you that they dealt with imposter syndrome. And it's people in our Congress, people that get elected to the House of Representatives when they first get there. It's not uncommon to think, oh my God, what am I doing here?

    Lauren Abrams:

    Yeah, who do I think I am?

    Seth Nelson:

    Right, who am I to be making it? And then they've been there a month and they're like, what the fuck are all these other people doing here? But no, I think it happens a lot in different professions. When you sit at a board meeting and you first get elected to a board, you're like, what am I doing here? People are putting me in this leadership position. If you're in any new endeavor, even if you just got a job and you're like, oh my God, really? They're paying me this? It happens, it happens a lot. And because we can be so critical of ourselves, it is I think more prevalent in our society and isn't talked about as much as it should be.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Yeah, that's very true.

    Seth Nelson:

    And people are so afraid to make a mistake, and I think it was Einstein, and I could have this wrong a little bit, but he basically was in front of a class and he added a very long series of numbers together and he was just rattling them off and he did this by design and then he said, yeah, one plus one is three. And everybody talked about how he missed one plus one is three, right? It was the wrong answer. It should have been two obviously. But no one talked about the complicated ones that he did. We always point out the negative and you do that in yourself and that builds to this imposter syndrome.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Yeah. No, it's true.

    Pete Wright:

    As attorneys, do you find you have to step into that emotional battle in your client's divorce process? Do you ever find you have to say, look... Like talk to a client the way you're sort of asking us to talk to ourselves?

    Seth Nelson:

    Oh, I've had clients that have listened to the podcast and they say, well, Seth, I feel like I know you, I know your voice, I know what you're going to say. I talk the same way to clients that I talk on this show. Now I might meet them at their level or explain things a little differently or be harder on some clients than other because the way that they take in information, some people are like, oh, send me an email. Some people are like, shoot me a text. Some people are like, no, give me a call on the phone. Some people don't hear me unless I write them a very clear, long letter saying, take my advice. Some people need me to say, you're being stupid. That's the emotional side of you. Let's get back to the legal side. So there's different ways that you have to meet them at their level. It's the same conversation.

    Lauren Abrams:

    And I don't practice family law at all, but-

    Seth Nelson:

    You're smart.

    Lauren Abrams:

    I definitely speak to my clients the same. I'm like, you need to clear out space and make room for other things. I will always speak to clients the same way. I'm the same person everywhere pretty much. I mean, I will speak from a somewhat spiritual level, somewhat.

    Pete Wright:

    Well, let's use that opportunity to introduce formally 52 Weeks of Hope. Tell us about your podcast. Why'd you start it? What are you doing there? You don't practice family law. What's a non-family law attorney doing something as heart centered as a podcast called 52 Weeks of Hope.

    Lauren Abrams:

    52 Weeks of Hope is where people talk about the hardest challenge they've overcome, how they did it, and give a message of hope, and it started from my own Dark Knight of the Soul. I'm somebody who's always very grateful. Now the tool I use is I exchange gratitude lists every day. Been exchanging it with my friend for 14 years and daily. She does hers at night, I do mine in the morning. And there's a lot of other people now that are part of our gratitude chain too.

    The only way through is through, everybody goes through their stuff. Once I got through this particular one, I was like, what the hell was that? And then I was like, why are we here? And I went through that whole kind of thing. We go through these things and I'm busy, I was raising, single mom, raising both kids. I was given full custody and I decided I was going to ask a much older demographic, what have you gleaned from living life? They say nobody on their deathbed ever wished they worked harder, made more money. So I wanted to know what these people tell me. What have you learned? It's as close as I come to DIYing, if that's a word. I'm not a DIY.

    Seth Nelson:

    It is now. We're good.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Yeah. I'm not a DIYer. And so I started interviewing a person a week just going and talking to them and people would divulge really personal information to me. I'm not a shrink or anything, but they would tell me, probably all my [inaudible 00:26:47] skills. Anyway, but I would just go and I would talk to these people and after about two and a half months I was like, this is so rich. It's so good. I have to share it. They started being really common themes, and I thought I'd write one of these books where you open up, you're like, that's just what I needed to hear, or you close it and you open it again, you're like, no, that's what I needed to hear, and call it 52 Weeks of Hope.

    And then COVID hit and the pandemic came and I started podcasting, and I really never even listened to podcasts, maybe Oprah or Brené Brown. That was kind of it. Anyway, so I started podcasting, fell in love with it, wasn't confined to Los Angeles anymore, and I've never looked back. I didn't put the book out. I have a few of the chapters on my website, and after 52 Weeks, my first 52 Weeks episode, I compiled all the messages of hope into eight overarching themes and I call it the meaning of life. I'm like, okay, now I know. So that is the podcast, and now I'm a couple years in.

    Pete Wright:

    Yeah, I was going to say, you really have screwed up the podcast name.

    Lauren Abrams:

    I know.

    Pete Wright:

    I mean, 126 Weeks of Hope doesn't have the same kind of ring to it, but there is a rich bounty of interview material in this show, and congratulations on a healthy, long run of great interviews. It's always great to have other podcasters on the show, but particularly attorney podcasters. Pretty rarefied air.

    Seth Nelson:

    I'm just a little worried. The next time I listen to your podcast, it's going to be Pete talking about how he had to deal with me and how to get over it.

    Lauren Abrams:

    Yeah.

    Pete Wright:

    Apropo of nothing. We'll get in touch about that schedule later. Hey, this has been really great. So we'll put the link to the podcast in the show. And your website, you want people to visit?

    Lauren Abrams:

    Yeah, everything's on the website. It's 52weeksofhope.com, the number 52. Very easy. And right now we're offering free clarity and confidence boost sessions, and there's a clarity and confidence growth scorecard on there too, a little checklist of things you can do over a 21 day period.

    Pete Wright:

    There you have it. 52 Weeks of Hope, number 52, check it out. Thank you so much, Lauren, for your participation today, and thank you everybody for downloading and listening to this show. Give yourself some confidence. Look yourself in the eye, in the mirror, give yourself some confidence, and then go journal about it. On behalf of Lauren Abrams and Seth Nelson, America's favorite divorce attorney, I'm Pete Wright. We'll catch you next week right here on How to Split a Toaster, the divorce podcast about saving your relationships.

    Outro:

    Seth Nelson is an attorney with NLG Divorce and Family Law with offices in Tampa, Florida. While we may be discussing family law topics, How to Split a Toaster is not intended to, nor is it providing legal advice. Every situation is different. If you have specific questions regarding your situation, please seek your own legal counsel with an attorney licensed to practice law in your jurisdiction. Pete Wright is not an attorney or employee of NLG Divorce and Family Law. Seth Nelson is licensed to practice law in Florida.

Pete Wright

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